Author and Anglican Priest Lionel Fanthorpe (1) returned to the show to sharehis research into the mysteries of Templar treasure and the Holy Grail. He named three possibilities as to what the Holy Grail might be: the sacred relic of Christ's cup from the Last Supper, an ancient magical artifact, or a reference to the actual bloodline of Mary Magdalene and Jesus, (Mary according to Fanthorpe was a descendent of King David). Legend has it that the offspring from this Christ bloodline eventually became the Merovingians that ruled France, he said.
The Templar Knights, who were involved in the mysteries and hidden treasures at Rennes-le-Chateau in France, may have been looking for ancient divination stones when they searched under Solomon's Temple back in 1118, he continued. The secretive Knights may have originated from a far older group-- "ancient guardians" who date back into the "dim parts of history," he noted.
Fanthorpe also theorized about the Ark of the Covenant, suggesting that Moses may have taken it from Egypt when they escaped, and that was possibly why they were so adamantly pursued by the Pharaoh because he was trying to get back what may have been a "great power source."
John Titor: Reactions
We asked for reactions to the provocative John Titor(1) time travel story presented on Friday's show(2) with guest Oliver Williams. Here are some of the responses we received:
John Titor stated in no uncertain terms that the United States would undergo a type of "revolution or civil war."Beyond a doubt, a showdown that may put our democracy to the test is silently building around the persuasive political capabilities of Dr. Steven Greer as he builds a convincing case against the "shadow government" bureaucracy. From the grassroots of informed citizens such as the Coast to Coast AM audience, to the "behind closed doors" meetings with government officials, and sworn statements of government employees, the movement has legs......
Dr Greer has the guts, the intelligence, the desire, and the momentum to carry this off. Will Dr. Greer be in the forefront of the movement which will make truth of the most outlandish of the Titor predictions?
My reaction to this story was that it is not out of the realm of realityand could be credible, and thus our immediate future is depressing andunsettling. Is there a way to find John as a 6-year old living herenow? The only confusing thing was his parents living in both times andwhat are their ages? Hope John returns again soon to give us more infoand advice.
Sun City West, AZ
I can easily tell his story is fake. It's pretty convenient that every answer he gave is done in such away as to be vague and how things could be different in this timeline then his. He was far too careful about what he said and how he said it. Anyone with a level head knows it's a hoax. He's not the first person to make outrageous claims on forums.
As a high profile graphic designer/studio owner I have examined the images of both the time machine and supposed manual. They are fake. The time machine is a prop and doesn't match the images in the manual if you know what to look for. Heck I can make a manual like that myself. The topic of time travel is very interesting, but this guy is a fake. Look closely at the diagram pictures of it. His science is also very flawed and he utilizes techno babble to hide it.
It's also interesting how the time machine is the exact same dimensions as a type of ammo box. I know this because I have done a lot of 3D design and animationon military projects. I know this is not what people want to hear, but I call it like I see it.
The John Titor story is totally enthralling, and after hearing about it on the show the other night for the first time, I spent that entire night reading everything i could about it and looking at all the photos i could find... I believed it for about 12 hours, but...perhaps sadly, perhaps not, as compelling as the story is, i could not help but conclude that it is an elaborate hoax.
Here is a site which has already addressed this issue pretty satisfactorily... livejournal.com/community/hoaxes/90359.html. The story is extremely compelling, and seems upon first examination to be sufficiently rich in internal detail as to preclude speculation about its legitimacy ... but if you really examine it rationally, and without bias, it becomes clear that the story is a hoax, though it certainly serves as a valuable social commentary when viewed as such... to me, the real mystery, or at least the most interesting aspect, of this case is the hoaxer's motives or what outcome he foresaw or desired....
Ft. Lauderdale, FL
I have received permission from my superiors to send you this one communiqué.I believe that it is time to put the saga of John Titor to rest once and for all. I too am from the future and am an officer in the Temporal Fraud Division, of the Chronology Bureau.
Let me state to you right now that "John Titor" is a real person, although this is not his actual name. We of the future have strict laws governing time travel, for the obvious reasons, and Mr. Titor has broken these laws.We do the best we can keeping track of those who would use time travel to their own advantage or to dupe those of earlier times. However every now and then one of these criminals does manage to elude us for a time.
This felony in our time is rather akin to the problem you are having with Identity Theft in your time. Instead of stealing identities however, these people are literally stealing your time.I hope you understand the unbelievable damage that a person form our time, knowing every single detail and fact of your time could do.Mr. Titor has been apprehended and was dealt with according to our laws. He shall not be bothering you again. You were lucky this time.This will be the one and only communication you shall receive from me.
Mano Detrium TFD
I am unsure about all of this, but I am leaning towards "fiction." But as others will most likely mention, the Mad Cow disease reference seems to be right on target even before it was a big deal in the UK. Very scary. Also, US citizens sacrificing rights for security is also a disturbing reference that seems to be coming true everyday.
However, the stuff I can't make myself buy into is another US civil war, Russia nuking our cities, and the lack of John mentioning a nuclear winter scenario with all of the destruction and radiation. He just says that it was a rough time period and that many died. If we actually had a global nuclear war, God bless those that perish and have mercy on the ones that remain.
I can't believe anyone who can operate a computer takes that nonsense seriously! Even without the photos being credibly debunked, the work is obviously a creative writing project done by someone far more intelligent than the believers she took in. I particularly enjoyed the history of the hoax I saw online when the subject was still current. The early versions were pretty unsophisticated, and soon forgotten by the believers. Humans never cease to amaze me.
Grand Junction, CO
I live in a corner of Washington State, 150 miles from Seattle, - I'm surprised almost everyone I talk to, here or in Seattle, all ages, I'm 61, --want a democratically elected President, the Constitution honored, no--NO lobbyist, --da ta da, in other words we want America back,--and Revolution would be fine if that is necessary.Our present leaders are so out of touch with the citizensIf we have much more trouble with our present government, they (we) are in deep trouble.And Americans are not wimps, we just take a while to get mad- and then historically attack problems with lightening speed and resolve.
Carol Wolf (the majority)
I have written the three books on the time-travel methods, adventures, etc. used by Steven L. Gibbs and both Steve and I have read/listened to the John Titor material with great interest. First of all, there is a gentleman in Miami, Florida who has gotten fantastic results with Steve's HDR (hyper-dimensional resonator unit) and he has found several alternate time-lines for the future (for the US) by adding a Tesla coil to Steve's invention. His name is Carlosand he has described to us (before we read the Titor material) alternative futures that dovetail with what Titor has also described!
In addition to this, Steve has noticed that many of the other details about time-travel Titor has given seem to parallel what he has also noticed--notably what it would be like leaving one time period and arriving at the next. In short, I read the Titor material AFTER writing about Steve and have found that what they both say is comparable. There is nothing in Steve's experience that would negate what Titor has said. Carlos and I agree that time-travel is accomplished more easily if one can find a powerful vortexin which to operate any devices.
It is my personal belief that if the vortex-or the point of time-slippage as I describe it-is powerful enough, the equipment required to push one over into a different time-frame or universe is minimal! In many places on earth this happens quite naturally-and frequently!
author of Stranger than Fiction, The True Time-Travel Adventures of Steven Gibbs
I believe that John is right on target! I know for a fact that local militias are already preparing for a civil war, and know we just heard that the UN has been called into monitor our elections, this is tantamount to a slap in the face of every American who has been screaming "One World Order!" for the last twenty years! I have been called and accused of every crime under the sun because I have been trying to get people to wake up to the fact that we are losing our Rights under the Constitution for years.
Our local units of government have said: "you do not take all of the rights at once, you take them a little at a time." The very taking of our private property and giving it to the government is just one example of what will start the civil war in this country. Can we all say "environmentalism extremeism!" Just as John has warned, we had better wake up! Not tomorrow either, right now!!!
Another part of John's comments were, we need to go through this civil war, and I believe that whole heartedly! We as Americans will not wake up until it actually happens. The ol' saying, you do not miss the water until the well runs dry. Take good care and keep up the good work.
I didn't think anything could be farther from the truth initially hearing the story. But I couldn't stop listening to the program. I listen to tales like this as if they are fiction, and extrapolate and discern relevant bits and pieces. However, I was blown away by the time travel story. To me, the bottom line is these points are valid whether the source is verifiable or not.
I now feel personally responsible for encouraging everyone I know to question the Patriot Act. In just the last 3 days I have talked to my friends and family about our civil liberties. I have not ever been as motivated to campaign for a cause until now. (I was motivated enough in the 1992 election to become a voter registar) The point is this story compels anyone who thinks, and isn't a 'sheep', to vocalize their adamant disapproval of the current administration's policies regarding civil liberties.
I don't know what I can do personally. I have to figure something out. I'm starting by bringing up the conversation and clarifying others understandings of the current right to due process. People have said "that law doesn't apply to us, (American citizens)" or "that law hasn't even been used" Greatly alarming sentiments. Don't they care that these laws apply to all citizens? And these are smart, politically savvy men who made these statements.
The other powerful message from JT is mad cow disease. I am a quasi vegetarian already, based in large part on my fear of MCD. My intuition is confirmed by his point on the dormancy period. Why take the chance? Will I ever eat beef again? Yes, but it won't be McDonalds or any other bargain beef. It will be maybe once a year at Ruth's Chris Steakhouse. So again, his message is based in large part on common sense. We just don't have the perspective he apparently does.
And the final point that has stayed with me strongly is the notion of getting to know people 100 miles away, and what would I take with me, if I could only carry my belongings on my back. I haven't figured that out, but it raises interesting questions.
I am a Navy scientist, and thus relatively objective about things. But the John Titor story disturbed me. I downloaded it on Saturday and listened to it Saturday night. Even though I was extremely tired, I could not stop until I'd heard the entire show.
My sleep was disturbed all that night - I was totally hooked on the story. On many levels, the story seems plausible; and therefore it's worrisome. I'll be watching world events even more carefully than normal now, for any sign that John's predictions (or rather his memories) will come true. And, just for chuckles, I'll read more of his writings. At the very least, it's pretty decent fiction.
I still remain skeptical, however. An initially plausible story is not necessarily a true story, no matter how compelling.And an initially plausible story may not remain that way upon deeper inspection. As an example, the multiple universe concept Titor espouses remains an interesting, untestable theory. If true, there may be a universe, and an Earth, where Napoleon established a long lasting empire. We might be speaking French in some Universe. In another, we might be speaking German. Or WW III may have actually occurred during the Cuban Missile Crisis, in which case we might not be speaking at all!
Imagine a universe, a non-Hollywood universe, where a meteor missed the Earth and giant dinosaurs still reign supreme. (I wonder if dinosaurs would have eventually gotten around to building radios and computers?) The point is, if time travel takes us to another universe, isolated from our own, then "our" planet might be wholly unrecognizable. Going back in time doesn't have much meaning if the course of events in that universe differ considerably from ours. The traveler might as well be visiting a different planet.
And that is the primary reason that I think a time traveler, bouncing in and out of various multiverses, would be exceedingly lucky to find a particular computer built during our past, since his past, and ours, are presumably not identical. Unless of course we have managed to build in the next 30 years a multiverse scanner, so we can tune in on all possible (like infinite?) universes, and zip through each universe's time history till we find a particular planet, and a particular time, with a particular gadget we need. I'm sorry, but that's not bloody likely.
And this little thing about a civil war: if we as a society are so lazy and sheep-like, as Titor proclaims, is it realistic to believe we will suddenly develop enough of a social consciousness to lay down our life battling our government? Our lifestyle is pretty cozy, so I'm doubtful that lazy, sheeplike people would give it all up over an election result gone astray. Besides, our government has really big guns.
No, in the America that Titor describes, Americans, on average, might be willing to fight, but only during the commercial breaks. Which means they won't be getting very far from their recliner and their beer cooler.
As for carrying tiny black holes around in a suitcase -- the concept of creating tiny black holes is only viable because the things are so tiny, and evaporate so quickly, that they have no time to eat anything of real worth (like people, cities, worlds). In spite of CERN's efforts, it will still take a little while for humans to create these blackholes, and only then with a stupendous amount of power. So are we to believe that in only 30 years or so we'll be able to confine two of those star-eating beasts inside a suitcase? Won't the power cord be a bit cumbersome?
And are we to believe that this awesome technological feat will be accomplished in a world recovering from WWIII; in a world so devoid of technology that it needs an archaic computer? The phrase "non sequitor" comes to mind. In spite of my initial visceral reaction, I think the story has way too many holes (of whatever color) to be believeable.The technical and sociological complications to Titor's story mount up quickly, essentially sabotaging it.Maybe a good science fiction writer can fix the technical flaws, in which case it might make a good read. To be fair, the C2C program entertained me for a few hours, which is not bad for the price, and made me think. And I guess that's really the point.
Bumper music from Tuesday August 10, 2004
- Captain of Her Heart
- China Grove
- Every Breath You Take
- Horse with No Name
- Inca Dance
- Love Grows (Where My Rosemary Goes)
- Midnight Confessions
- Midnight Express (The Chase)
- Midnight Express (The Chase)
- Mother and Child Reunion
- Once in a Lifetime
- Rebel Rebel
- Sweet Talkin' Woman
Electric Light Orchestra
- Thank the Lord for the Night Time
- When You Come Back to Me
- Still is Still Moving to Me